I get it. You’re mad that the 3rd National Flag of the confederacy isn’t flying on the Sutherlin Mansion grounds anymore.
This isn’t the way to show your objections.
By now, you probably know that Senator Tim Kaine was doing his regular “tour the entire state” trip and was scheduled to stop at Danville’s Goodyear plant last Thursday for a tour and a quick meet-and-greet. Those plans were cancelled because of a makeshift Confederate flag rally that was going to go past the plant during Kaine’s stop.
An anonymous person sent SouthsideCentral this through our Contact Us! anonymous tipline…
Yeah. Seriously. Senator “McKain”.
I understand the frustration that these people have, but pulling stunts like this just hardens the resolve of the flag opponents. Not only that, the people that really didn’t care one way or the other about the flag look at stunts like this in a negative way.
These types of stunts will never bring the flag back. Never. If you want the flag back on the mansion grounds, concentrate your efforts on things like the Historic Preservation Association’s pending lawsuit against the city. Have your own peaceful protests. Do community service things like the Sons of Confederate Veterans do when they clean up and maintain Confederate gravesites. Be more like Steve Adkins, Ed Chaney, Wayne Byrd, Jock Owens and Vernell Dixon.
Don’t piss off your political enemies when your side has already taken severe losses in the battle. Show the respect that you want shown to you. Do the right thing, people.
Thanks for posting this.
Thank you for the kind words. I’m already getting hate mail on this editorial as expected.
Bruce why don’t you reach out to them to offer consultation services. I was not aware that you were so passionate for there cause. It appears as though they need the help. Way to go.
I’m always willing to rationally discuss the issues.
Bruce, we enjoy your forays into the news, but you DO offer your opinions and editorials, as well. Expect some push back when a significant part of the population disagrees with you about the takedown of Southern History. We saw that coming, and probably–you did as well. Was this demonstration not an exercise of the First Amendment? After all, under that statute, nowadays, people can desecrate the national flag. I do not know these folks who showed their opinions for the Senator and the Mayor to see, but I suspect that there is a lot more in store. This is America…and in particular, this is the state where there was the most sacrifice in that awful war. Prepare to see more flags than we ever suspected existed, before. In my humble opinion….
I strongly encourage people to challenge my opinions. Yes, I support the 1st amendment rights of the people to hold the protest, and I also use my 1st Amendment rights to write about it. Once those protests turn into intimidation, I will draw that proverbial line.
Thank you!
“Don’t piss off your political enemies when your side has taken severe losses…” 😀
What are they if they aren’t ALREADY self-righteously, ignorantly, egotistically pissed off? Do you REALLY expect us to believe they’ll ever say, “Oh these poor folks – We’ve been too hard on them. Look how reasonable they’re being! Let’s cut them a break…”? Go try that rationale with the Caliphate and see where your head ends up.
However, I’m glad to hear that you’re anti-intimidation. A member of the group I’m proud to be associated with, the Virginia Flaggers (you’re welcome, Danville :D), actually took the Chesterfield County lady who recently had her yard and flag torn up a NEW flag and installed a new pole for her. I hope she got your reasonably-worded sympathy card recommending reconciliation with her attackers during all the hustle and bustle.
Our enemies have been evil, unfair, and prejudiced against us before this ever started, and their temporary media glow will only encourage them to further acts of outrage with no thought for our wishes or feelings if we don’t fight back. Your one-hand-tied strategy has lost America every war it’s fought in the last six decades, because America’s enemies didn’t CARE if outsiders liked or approved of them, and because they had a cause they believed in.
Sound familiar? 🙂
Fairness ends on the playground. Severe losses = Fight harder and meaner. Your Confederate ancestors (if you have any) could tell you that. And if they lost their fight, the descendants of some of those brave men are STILL fighting 150 years later, by any means necessary.
As respectfully as I can manage it,
Rocky
P.S. – Have you referred to the Black Lives Matter protests as “stunts” or to the protesters as “these people”?
I fully support you and the Virginia Flaggers’ rights to put as many flagpoles and flags up that you can.
Wow. Just in from the Virginia Flagger flying their I-95 Stafford flag:
“I have learned that most but by no means all blacks are a worthless bunch of freeloading, dangerous, animals that should be put down like the dogs they are. My opinion of the black race is dismal at best and getting worse.”
http://restoringthehonor.blogspot.com/2015/08/who-is-hubert-wayne-cash.html
That’s the Virginia Flaggers for you!
Google Raymond Agnor in Lexington as well. These are the kinds of hateful people that are in the va flaggers, the kinds of people that the flaggers will bring with them to Danville, and the kinds of people that will offer their land for giant spite-flags.
I’m sure Rocky will be along any time now to address how a member of his organization is acting in this deplorable fashion.
Rocky? Rocky? Where’d you go?
Rocky Hawkins excellent rebuttal!!!!
I really get a laugh over know-it-all Liberals/Progressives/Haters/Silly Pretend Journalist, who Cry about the Public reacting to their “Policies”. Only “They” know what’s best for us Southerners in Our Own Town. Amazing “Their” Arrogance!
Luckily, I’m none of those.
You say “Our Own Town” but Danville isn’t your town. The only interest that you have in Danville is the Confederate flag.
All Barry does is ride to other people’s towns and agitate. Lexington, Charlottesville, Danville – he’s dined all over. He doesn’t even live in Richmond proper but plays armed neighborhood watch for statues with his buddies on Monument Ave. they are not welcome here!
Well then. If Mr. Isenhour has dined at one of Danville’s restaurants, I give him credit for helping the local economy. 😀
Just thought I would let you know there is a push to change the name of a high school in northern VA from J. Stuart to another name. Remember Stuart was a southern member of the war. According to members of the school. They want to change the name because they feel the old name is racist. Where does all this stop; until everything related the war of northern aggression has completely wiped out everyone from the south who was Parr of this war? History has always favored the Victor of wars and so it goes on even now
I think that push to change the name of the school is idiotic.
I think their point is more that the school was named after Stuart as a clear act of segregationist defiance and not so much that he was a Confederate. The school opened during massive resistance to Brown v. Board.
That said, I don’t think the school ought to be renamed. Thurgood Marshall is a fine choice for school name, but that area constantly expands. Give another school that name. The movement is hardly idiotic, but I don’t see the movement picking up too much steam.
Wow, probably the most nicely-worded cry of pain I’ve ever read in my life.
That Senator Kaine would actually be afraid of the dozen to couple hundred of people who might have shown up – men, women and young people who have demonstrated in over 200 protests this summer peacefully I might add – does not show any sort of “resolve” on the part of the political opponents of the flag. What it shows is misguided fear based on narrow-minded prejudices and stereotyping.
I agree that positive efforts are necessary such as the ones you mentioned – and the gentlemen you mention I happen to know quite well, in point of fact.
I would also agree that standing up and speaking out loudly against prejudiced mindsets that support a pro-white supremacist misuse of the living symbol of Southern identity is also more than necessary – it is in fact the duty of all honorable Confederate descendants to do so.
The 3rd National flag at the mansion will at some point be returned, either through reasoning, lawsuits, or when it becomes apparent to those who run the place that removing it will hurt their business in the long run….and if not, well considering the large battle flags going up near the town, I’d say that flag is going to be around a very long time in one way or another. Granted I would like that to be with co-operation from all parties involved and with recognition of that heritage for the positive role it serves. Yet even without that, those of us who honor that flag in a positive way do not require the approval of those who stereotype and ridicule us.
As for your final, and somewhat misinformed comment about “taking several big losses” I would remind you of a recent poll shows an overwhelming support for the view of that flag as a positive symbol of heritage by Virginians as a whole. Believe me when I say that in the long-run we’re doing quite well, and anticipate doing even better in the coming decade.
Thank you for the rational and well-worded reply.
For clarification, the “big losses” that I was referring to was the license plate and the flag on the museum grounds issue.
Ladies and gentlemen, Mr. Carl Roden:
https://overthrowdotcom.wordpress.com/2015/08/23/carl-w-roden-is-now-a-meme-thanksbrad/
Wait… sex fiction about a Nickelodeon kid show?
Oh my. That’s just creepy.
Researching his Twitter account, I found this um… slightly disturbing one.
Fun fact — none of the big Danville flags have been 3rd flags so far. That kills the heritage/history line dead cold.
I am the founder of the SVFTF. Thanks for the press, but what you forgot to mention was that we just raised and donated $1200 to a local black family that needed help. You also failed to notate that we are publicly planning the largest concert that our area has ever seen, with ALL of the proceeds going to local charities and schools. You also neglected to write about the work that we are doing with our local food bank to fill their shelves. I will not hide with anonymity. My name is Ryan Allen, and if you have any questions or concerns over what we’re doing as a group, please don’t hesitate to contact me. Just do me a favor, if you wish to stalk my Facebook, look through the whole thing and post the good too.
Awesome Reply, Ryan… You are supported!!
I look forward to meeting you. I had no idea of your group even existing until someone sent me that graphic in the article.
FYI: The racial background of the family that your group helped is irrelevant.
Apparently it is relevant to him, and that says a darn lot.
It is relevant for him because the SCV and flaggers use people of color as props: “SEE, we’re not racist!!! You tha real racist for thinking it.” Their understanding of race is that superficial. Look at the va flaggers facebook, every time a person of color stops to talk with them they are photographed and put online. I suspect that in this case the chance to publicize their (white) noblesse oblige made it especially attractive as a photo op.
The racial background of the people helped is irrelevant as to the need for/ kindness of the deed..it was made relevant by the people who constantly accuse anyone who supports the flag of hating black people. I think you would agree, the only way to prove an accusation is false is to show the truth. I’ve never believed in blowing your own horn, but the only way to combat comments like Rev. Campbell made in a public city council meeting is to show he was wrong. And with the current bias in much of our media (SCC excluded) the only way to advertise that is through social media telling your own story.
Well, I would like to offer this perspective, or opinion as the case may be, on your piece and the issue at hand. First off, please, drop the vulgarity in the title line. Expressive, but completely unnecessary.
Second- without dragging on, I was largely indifferent to the matter of flying the flag, and recall quite well the 90’s fiasco. I could relate an interesting story about that, but the Third National should have been left on the monument. In an overall sense for the reasons of upholding the integrity of the law(the 1912 agreement) and the honor of keeping one’s word per the 1994 resolution/agreement. Overall the message it sends, even if subtly and certainly insidiously, is that the law doesn’t matter and disrespect toward a chivalrous conduct of honor can be tossed aside at a whim to feelings or petulant demands. These are very dangerous precedents to set that can have dire long range consequences. Problem is, when they rear their ugly head, those that set up the situations that tend to fester are generally long gone or far removed from bearing the responsibility for what they preordained to occur. Somebody else gets the bill for the bad stuff, that old “kick the can down the road” cliché they are so fond of tossing about.
So, indifferent I was, but not now. Heck, I didn’t even own a battle flag, do now. Had a Gasden, never used it, loaned it out. Got a fresh one now. Looking for my own great big Third National, too. I honor my ancestors sacrifices, for whatever their reasons to join the fight of that terrible conflict, and the wounds they received, hardships they endured. I will more than ever now stand my ground to endure the same going forward. In my travels I have always seen more flags flown and displayed up north than down south, save for NASCAR tracks. I’ve also encountered far greater bigotry, racism, stereotyping and downright ignorant hatefulness up north than I’ve ever, ever seen down south. In your face confrontations, I neither started them or asked for them.
As far as you labeling any protest a “stunt”, don’t forget that those previous “stunts”, by men and women of far greater meddle than those of today, earned with blood, toil, families and real sacrifices the ability for your unalienable right to raise your voice to be able to protest without fear of public flogging, false imprisonment, summary execution or simply disappearing in the night. Why don’t you write about the sufferings and sacrifices of many of those brave men who stepped up to the challenge and dared pull a stunt like telling the greatest empire the world had ever known to stuff it. Tell of what grievous losses of family, comfort and fortune they put up with for the rights of the whiners today.
As far as staging a harmless drive by protest to make a statement, or Goodyear’s stunt of suppressing the free speech of an associate( the PC term for mere employee) to shelter such a spineless weasel as Kaine, how utterly droll of them or you to call it intimidation. If it “scares” him, he’s free to quit, the whole lot of all these gutless sniveling thieving politicians who are sucking us all dry and ruining this nation ought to be run out on a rail. The people have grown tired of their crimes, excuses, excesses and incompetencies.
If all this uproar over the flag is to be pegged upon the actions of one idiot criminal murderer in South Carolina, then what are all of us to make of the murderous actions of the nutcase from Roanoke that did his heinous deed at Smith Mountain today? What kinds of changes should “whites”(and I use that loosely since I’m of four Native tribal descendants) demand and receive? After all, it’s only fair, right?
As far as financial repercussions, I’ve already been made aware of multiple persons taking several business transactions amounting to many thousands of dollars to other areas that would have otherwise been spent in Danville, so I ask- “Who really is the greater loser here?” All choices have consequences, both positives and negatives.
You’ve used beautiful language in your op-ed, but you’ve conflated lots of things with the simple premise of my editorial.
Even if this protest had went on as scheduled and Tim Kaine saw everything, absolutely nothing would have changed to bring your side any closer to the endgame that you desire. This is the same problem that I have with the Tea Party movement. I love most of their ideas, but they haven’t accomplished much in reality. They’ve elected very few candidates on their own and are now in a fight to keep control of the RPV’s State Central Committee. They’re about to get ousted after leading the party to five straight defeats.
But I digress… I’m sticking with my original point. If you want the flag back at the Sutherlin Mansion, show people that it’s really about heritage and education.
I died laughing…
“McKaine”
so much for all those ‘historians’